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The Universim Community Labs - Mission #7

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What about if the Cemetary had a family crypt option? Therefore, a Crypt slot would be able to hold all members of the immediate family. I realise that all Nuggets are related, so, it would have to be limited to the current household maybe?

 

 

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I think that the cemetery should have a lot more space than it has today, which will significantly reduce the problem with dead bodies.

It would also be a good idea if you could draw an area the grave keeper is working in, a civilization with 50 nuggets shouldn't really have grave yard problems, what happens when you have larger cities?
 

Also, I think the infection risk is way too high, nuggets should primarily try to avoid an infected area rather than running through it constantly.

(as a norse) I think the pyre is a cool feature, although way to expensive. Negative effects could be pollution or something.

 

As it is now i usually pick up dead bodies and fling them out in space, fastest way to get rid of a rotting problem..

 

 

 

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hace 20 minutos, Jono dijo:

What about if the Cemetary had a family crypt option? Therefore, a Crypt slot would be able to hold all members of the immediate family. I realise that all Nuggets are related, so, it would have to be limited to the current household maybe?

 

 

 

I really like this idea, although if we want to see it I suppose we will have to wait until they make the genealogic tree at least.

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HI all

How about a prioritize button on the pyres so they deliver wood faster. This would of course slow down building as they would have to make sure pyre is full before building anything and delivery to the wood refinery.

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Had a new issue with the cemeteries and funeral pyre....I played today and got to 60 nuggets successfully. However the grave diggers stopped functioning all together and no one was bringing the bodies to the pyre at all. I had to fling them all away from my civilization. Also I had floating dead bodies that I couldn't grab to fling away and the infection zone was underneath them....so that by itself killed everyone.

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Here are my thoughts regarding features in question

 

Cemetery

  • Either make them a lot smaller or increase their capacity a lot bigger (x100). In every game I end up having a town surrounded by three or four cemeteries which take a lot of space.
  • I would suggest handling corpses as other resources were free nuggets will deliver them to the cemetery. Possibly making it a family task (spouse or next of kin). This resource should be handled with certain priorities to avoid disease spreading. Make it so that if a nugget dies to far away he is lost and nobody will go look for him, maybe his family will mourn him since they didn't recover the body.
  • Either remove the gravedigger position or give it the following responsibilities:
    • His job is to free space, merge tombs etc, tend to the beauty of the cemetery. Making other nuggets feel that their lost ones are treated with respect.
    • Keep it in order to make it a bottleneck for burying corpses (see my comments on pyre).

Pyre

  • Handling the dead shouldn't be a key worry for a god game, so I think that having two buildings for dead management with similar functions is too much. So I propose using them for different situations. Pyres should be temporary buildings used in times of urgency (plagues, wars, natural disasters). When the cemeteries are not burying fast enough it is time to build one. So the gravediggers would be the bottlenecks here. 
  • Alternatively remove them completely and add them as an added features for cemeteries. This would be an acceptable option I believe.

Reproduction

  • Well, I think this should be handled via a family planning kind of system. Basically as a civilization advances families tend to have less and less children, so I think this should be what the game should use. In fact maybe this should be a researched science or some type of cultural achievement where the families start having less and less children (up to a minimum of course)
  • In this case Matchmaking wouldn't help a lot, but maybe the god could inspire the nuggets to have less or more children in general. I wouldn't make this power at a nugget basis, but more to the civilization in general.

Bugs

  • I would definitely tackle AI bugs first, I get many games ruined by errors in AI. Specifically (i have videos of the first two if required):
    • Nuggets failing to give up the resources they are carrying to a building in construction. 
    • Pathfinding around mountains and bodies of water sometimes fails and nuggets end up going all around this objects to get things that can be reached with a more direct path.
    • Stone huts placements. I don't know if this really causes issues but today for example I had a stone hut built right at the door of the hospital. I think the hospital was still accessible anyway.
  • I would review the buildings upgrade system, I had a situation on the previous patch where I had studied the upgrade of water pumps and due to so many buildings getting created I suddenly got a water shortage. I couldn't build anymore pumps since I couldn't use the refineries and now pumps required refined resources to be built.

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Hey guys, recently bought and love this game. 

 

- Cemeteries.  I feel a good idea would be to have the Nugget bodies biodegrade in the graves, thus opening them up for reuse. Also the Nugget operating it seems to forget a body every once in awhile. 

 

- Pyres. Thinking less wood more bodies. would be a good idea. Also have them use it more. it saves on coffins/graves :) 

 

- Population is a more tricky one. you need to keep up without overfilling the population.  Trial and error, maybe make it so each Nugget couple can only have a certain number of little Nuggets? and only so many can reproduce based on time period.

 

I realize these have  been brought up but agree with them as great ideas.

 

odd things I've noticed so far.....

 

The bunker seems to be for display purposes only so far? 2 tornadoes and 0 nuggets ran for the shelter.

 

The Nugget needs could use some balancing. They always seem to be off taking care of needs more than working.

 

Fishing 6 fish per trip and quite a bit of time to gut them... not viable for a food source. maybe add more fish per trip or less time to catch/gut. 

Maybe a fishing net upgrade to increase catch size?

 

As always lets also keep moving to the future ;) Love this game as stated above, I am sure it will be THE great god game when finished!

I will keep watching for patches and exploring for bugs. 

 

Keep up the great work guys!

 

 

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Cemeteries:

 

I love this idea that's been mentioned in other posts!

  • After so many nugget years (50-70) that the graves become usable again. That's purely based on nuggets living longer and longer as you progress through the game.
  •  There should be an upgrade option like they pyre where you should be able to hold more plots (since you get more with other building upgrades).
  • As well as another gravedigger incase you get instances where two or more nuggets die at the same time because say one gravedigger is off stuffing his face, mating, drinking, sleeping, or preparing for a date.. yanno all those more important tasks LOL

Pyres:

 

I agree with the general census.. less costly, more functionality.

  • I'd love to see this tied into the cemetery and possibly gravediggers responsible for carrying the bodies. I like the idea of a spouse or next of kin delivering the bodies, but I worry about spreading infection.

Reproduction:

 

This is more of what I've noticed than a suggestion. My population seems to get to about 30 nuggets on their own and then it starts to die off. Literally my nuggets stop reproducing and I have to use the matchmaking god power to get them to mate and make baby nuggets. However, I do have a suggestion.

  • Why not make it so that if you turn off the stone hut.. that's like turning off mating? That way you have another way of controlling how fast your population grows. I've seen huts where some have 3 kids and some only have 1. I'd like to be able to control how many kids each household has so that I can keep it even and have a pretty steady population increase. It also allows you to fill in the gaps if suddenly a lot of nuggets that reached the elderly stage die off, from a natural disaster, etc.

Just a thought..

 

 

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Cemetery: 

- Echoing others, the capacity must be increased. Minimum 25, but perhaps 50. I say 50 because it seems odd to me that I should need two cemeteries before I've even progressed to a point where I'm making refined wood/stone in bulk quantities to support the next stage of civilisational development. I can see why I might need two eateries, or 6 fishing docks, but 3-4 cemeteries seems strangely out of whack against expectations.

- A mechanism for cycling plot spaces needs to be implemented. Whether the graves wither and get reused after X years, or some other regeneration factor. Hell even an expensive resurrect-from-the-dead God power that gives evil points would be amusing. Post-disaster clean-up and distance travelled should be the only reasons I should need to build another cemetery.

- The work/life balance of nuggets needs to be addressed in favour of more time spent working. Perhaps this will be alleviated when the other profession slots open up on every building, but that would require the population to be double what it is currently to be viable, and we aren't getting to that point without addressing the work/life balance issue in the first place (unless the ratio is dynamic based on some other factor).

- Bring down the invisible walls and allow nuggets to walk through the cemetery to use it, rather than have to enter/exit from the main hut, at least until the AI pathfinding is fixed.

- The tooltip needs to be updated to make clear exactly what the red ring around the building does on placement.

- Add something like how the Engineer's hut says 'Situation: Manageable' as a cue to build a new cemetery as things start to get out of the gravediggers hands. Lease on gravedigger distance is a must.

 

Pyre:

- This should be a plague-control device, or a signal tower to communicate with nuggets in another camp on the other side of an ocean (like the signal pyres in LOTR). Unless forests are regrowing on this planet, wood is too precious to be burned. I'd rather throw the bodies into the depths of space, which seems like more of a bug than a feature. Diseased bodies should be burned, but people dying of accidents and old age should go to the cemetery. Perhaps have a higher risk of people working in dirty professions like fisher and farmer to die of diseases. Future upgrade should be to a crematoria. 

- Nuggets should have the intelligence to attempt to avoid diseased bodies, at least on a semi-random basis (accidents happen), until there are so many bodies in their way that they can't help but get infected.

- The tooltip needs to be updated to make clear exactly what the red ring around the building does on placement. 

- Synergise building placements. If you have a working pyre next to a reservoir, the fire will keep the water liquid during the freezing depths of Winter (which seems to last longer than any other season). Placing pyres near eateries or hospitals should be bad juju. Small businesses near farms or the ocean should provide more happiness than those in a desert. Be creative with multiple pros and cons so we have to put more thought into our building placement than simply 'where do I have enough space for this?'

 

Reproduction:

- A certain amount of Malthusian boom/bust needs to still take place in the game if we're trying to simulate reality, though there's only so much reality we can or should put into a game that's meant to be fun to play.

- Truth be told I try to avoid Divine Punishment because the population explosion leads to a civilisational crash around 40-50 nuggets where everyone has a job, no one is breeding, and everyone is dying (despite there being plenty of food and water available). 

- The school learning mechanic could bring in the beginnings of a family-planning upgrade tree into the fold, as higher education leads to fewer children (but if we're sticking to the real world, this is also only true under circumstances of increasing economic wealth, low infant mortality, low childbirth mortality, and in the absence/presence of certain cultural norms - exactly how much of this we want the game to replicate is an open question).

- God match-making needs a list-like user interface. There's no getting around this, because individually handling nuggets is cumbersome, and getting the God-powers to fire off at all is a bit of a pain. 

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A lot of good posts about problems, let me just start by saying that Pyres seam to function better finally. People are bringing bodies to them and they seem to burn them, they are not so far back at priority so they do it with their other tasks. I can agree that cemeteries are a way to small. I managed to reach a population of 150 years age and had to build around 6 cemeteries or more, I lost track because I would demolish a cemetery when it was full because it was useless and build another one in its place. The biggest problem I noticed around this time is a still present problem with pathfinding being broken after population reaches 60. Nuggets get stuck at one place, majority of them, and stop doing anything useful and eventually die of hunger thirst or old age. They start floating at that time, being untargetable, start to lie partially underground and doing all sort of weird stuff. Guess we will have to wait for another patch to try to sort it out. But so far on my tests, all hell breaks loose after I reach a population of 60. My idea, and I think a necessity is to give us some kind of a tool to allow us to control the population growth. Also in future updates, you really should give nuggets that are doing farming and fishing and other seasonal tasks, a laborer functions when they are offseason.

 

I also had a period where I had an abundance of food, and resources and my population just stopped to reproduce. I dropped to 7 from 50 or something and was playing with matchmaking, and then it started to grow miraculously. Handling the bodies was a nightmare but I managed to recover and reach a 60 once again, then all hell broke loose.

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Hell at age 161

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I hope to see a state where nuggets get a bit independent, in a sense that they have a priority where they tend to survive. For example, if they are hungry, they prioritize farming because it will give them food. or if they are laboring and get hungry, they stop chopping wood and go find a food. I hate to see them die from hunger or thirst because they were occupied by entertaining while walking past a full well or a farm which had plenty of food in storage (that is mostly based on their pathfinding issues now). But still, I would like to see some degree of independence in them, a sense of a survivalist instinct, ability to drop what they were doing and go for food if it's critical. I hope to see them try to move if there is not enough food and go out and hunt or gather food from far away.

 

There is still no way of expanding. Where ever you start to build on a planet, nuggets still don't want to move and build their huts near their new job, they all travel from your evolution tower to where you put them and often die from thirst or hunger on their way to job XD (funny).

 

I also found a bug on all my playthroughs (3) with trying to finish a prayer mission. I seem to finish it, at least I think, and don't get a completed status, and the message gets stuck forever, and no more messages ever get received.

 

Edited by Nick-ZG
Video added

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Am 5.10.2017 um 21:44 schrieb jlreymendez:

Handling the dead shouldn't be a key worry for a god game, so I think that having two buildings for dead management with similar functions is too much.

 

You think?

Because every other building which is not cemetry or pyre is about the life of nuggets. So no, just two simple buildings about dead nuggets aren't too much I think. Especially since death is (at least in human culture) always a special and key point in like every culture ... from just let them lying around to fed the creatures to carrying the corpse in a ceremony through a city ...

 

Am 5.10.2017 um 21:44 schrieb jlreymendez:

I would review the buildings upgrade system, I had a situation on the previous patch where I had studied the upgrade of water pumps and due to so many buildings getting created I suddenly got a water shortage. I couldn't build anymore pumps since I couldn't use the refineries and now pumps required refined resources to be built.

 

Yes, defenitely. There are a bunch of situations where a god would need to build previous versions of buildings. I'd like to have the option to chose which versions too ... :)

 

 

vor 20 Stunden schrieb Eliseth:

Why not make it so that if you turn off the stone hut.. that's like turning off mating?

 

Hmm, first of all I think that switch turning the hut on and off would differ drastically from every other on/off switch of the buildings. I think there should be a straight consense - same buttons for same things. The other thing is: creating a button for the hut that regulate if mating is permitted would make a god power for spreading love pointless. And as soon you decrease the number of god powers, god powers itself become pointless. There should be a minimum number, e.g. a god power for basic interactions (healing, loving, fearing ...)

That's why I wanted the possibility to easily open as many character sheets I want and use the love-god-power on them.

 

For a time now I also think about hippie-nuggets: Some nuggets with a gene for polyamore ... nuggets that don't care if their beloved ones are mating with other nuggets. Hippie-nuggets: just sitting in circles, singing, playing guitar and ... making love (and a lot of new labourers xD)

 

vor 9 Stunden schrieb Nick-ZG:

There is still no way of expanding. Where ever you start to build on a planet, nuggets still don't want to move and build their huts near their new job, they all travel from your evolution tower to where you put them and often die from thirst or hunger on their way to job XD (funny).

 

Yeah, I was thinking the same: nuggets should consider to move as soon their jobs are out of a specific range from their hut.

But there is at least one problem with commuters: what about the partner? Let's say the she-nugget is mining stones in the far east. And the he-nugget is working at the eatery in the far west. Where should they put their hut? This would mean nuggets should be able to quit their jobs or better to switch jobs with nuggets ...

But this would create kinda chaos I think. Nobody will know who's working where ...

Maybe the previous call for an update of the inhabitants and housing UI would solve this: when you can also see the partner of every nugget on your planet you can probably assign both to jobs close to each other. Then they can move or build a new hut close to their jobs.

Maybe children should aim for taking the jobs of their parents over as soon they're dead. But at the same time they should looking for other partners than their own family in the buisiness but probably aim for mating with nuggets from close-by-factories. Because that would result in a bigger gene pool (other than incest) and at the same time a naturally grown new hut assemble will rise: different villages and cities will rise and grow close by different working areas.

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19 minutes ago, Ypsilon said:

 

You think?

Because every other building which is not cemetry or pyre is about the life of nuggets. So no, just two simple buildings about dead nuggets aren't too much I think. Especially since death is (at least in human culture) always a special and key point in like every culture ... from just let them lying around to fed the creatures to carrying the corpse in a ceremony through a city ...

 

Well, I think my key idea was that the two buildings should have very different functions. Right now I don't feel there is an meaningful reason that makes it necessary to have two different buildings. So either this reason needs to exist or one of the two buildings won't get built very often.

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vor 8 Stunden schrieb jlreymendez:

 

Well, I think my key idea was that the two buildings should have very different functions. Right now I don't feel there is an meaningful reason that makes it necessary to have two different buildings. So either this reason needs to exist or one of the two buildings won't get built very often.

 

Ok, yeah, they should be different. But as long as they quite differ in their advantages and penalties (e.g. pyre - very fast mass disposel of dead bodies at the cost of wood, free labourers carrying wood, pollution etc vs. cemetry - slow single funerals, clean and consuming lot of land) it should be more than ok to have different buildings.

And if these two have the functionality like said above, I can't see how one of this buildings could be an upgrade of the other. Or, at least, I can see it, but only in the way as supplement: like starting with one of it and the upgrade add the other building to the already existing, so that you can use both of them from then.

But then you need two on/off switches in this combined building to decide which of the part should work right now ... and then the overall layout differ quite a lot from all the other buildings. Plus you're way more flexible in creating your townscape if the buildings keep seperated from each other.

What you think about that? :)

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7 hours ago, Ypsilon said:

 

Ok, yeah, they should be different. But as long as they quite differ in their advantages and penalties (e.g. pyre - very fast mass disposel of dead bodies at the cost of wood, free labourers carrying wood, pollution etc vs. cemetry - slow single funerals, clean and consuming lot of land) it should be more than ok to have different buildings.

And if these two have the functionality like said above, I can't see how one of this buildings could be an upgrade of the other. Or, at least, I can see it, but only in the way as supplement: like starting with one of it and the upgrade add the other building to the already existing, so that you can use both of them from then.

But then you need two on/off switches in this combined building to decide which of the part should work right now ... and then the overall layout differ quite a lot from all the other buildings. Plus you're way more flexible in creating your townscape if the buildings keep seperated from each other.

What you think about that? :)

 

Yes, you are almost saying what I proposed. Pyre need to be there to save you at times of urgency, so the bodies are piling up and the gravediggers can't bury them fast enough, so you either start burning bodies at the cost of resources (wood mostly) or you will end up with a health issue.

 

I would still make the gravediggers sole job to bury people (or maybe also make room in the cemetery). Other nuggets should bring the dead bodies to him, otherwise it will become too slow as the population raises. And I will definitely make the cemetery tombs per land ratio A LOT bigger. I don't want my planet to be filled with cemeteries.

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At this point I cannot see the reasoning for Funeral Pyre, It doesn't seem to work in conjunction with the cemetery and it cannot be manned. Once it fills up with wood it just sort of sits there. The Cemetery definitely needs more spots, or it needs to be smaller. By the time I get a nugget population of around 20-25 and the first and second generation begin to die off I end up filling up two cemeteries. Also in the case of God powers and reproduction, in the event of a catastrophic wipe of the nuggets, being able to "remake Adam and Eve" would be very helpful. maybe make it a creation God power have it be 800 point cost or something. Then we can keep the planet going instead of restarting everything.

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vor 3 Stunden schrieb willybgood:

in the event of a catastrophic wipe of the nuggets, being able to "remake Adam and Eve" would be very helpful. maybe make it a creation God power have it be 800 point cost or something. Then we can keep the planet going instead of restarting everything.

 

Do you really want it to make it that easy?

I think you should be able to fail. Also fail massively. Because it's a sandbox game - and without some big mission goal the one thing that will keep us playing is the difficulty level of creating liveable planets. And for that there should always be the danger of the possibility being wiped out completely.

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Hey there!

 

Other areas of the game that need updates/tweaks are what are causing these 2 structures to be under scrutiny. (floating dead bodies you cannot pick up called "Half-Raptured", unable to access a body inside a certain building)

 

Cemetery:

  • Always my favorite way to get rid of bodies. I always build 2. Fill the first one up, destroy it and then swap the gravedigger (speed trait) to the other one. I use the cemeteries to "bottleneck" an area to prevent nuggets from going behind them, and place all dead bodies that can be picked up behind them so only the gravedigger has a reason to go back there. (Pic attached)
  • Allow for upgrading to increase capacity
  • Institute a 5 minute dissipation timer for tombstones

Pyre:

  • Nope, just get rid of it. I'm sure our nuggets won't mind Heaven over Valhalla.
  • Simplify the use of this building. Add a "dead body" count to the small panel, the amount of wood consumed will be equal to the total number of bodies to burn. 10 wood/per, 1 min/per  body
  • Get rid of the random flame buttons and the fire circle in the middle and replace it with "Press to burn" 
  • Once you press the "Burn these Fools" button, your workers will then move wood to the pyre based on the dead bodies. I don't want my workers putting wood inside/outside the pyre when it's not currently cooking.

All of this doesn't matter if the floating dead bodies and "Stockholm Bodies" stuck inside buildings are not dealt with.

____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Cupid:

  • By far my favorite update and allows me to fill houses that would otherwise go empty
  • Started Chupacabra play #2 (Chup2) and got to 40 people, dropped to 17 because I always run an older workforce and "Force mated" remaining skilled nuggets in the now "empty" houses and jumped back to 54 nuggets before "Half-Raptured" nuggets caused too much disease. 
  • It would be easier to find potential mating partners if we could see their "special" trait on the nugget overview panel. I find it hard to bounce around nugget to nugget trying to find someone I want to make a stud for their positive trait.

Will be posting a Chupacabra survival guide soon!

Gravedigger.jpg

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8 hours ago, Ypsilon said:

Really want it to make it that easy?

I think you should be able to fail. Also fail massively. Because it's a sandbox game - and without some big mission goal the one thing that will keep us playing is the difficulty level of creating liveable planets. And for that there should always be the danger of the possibility being wiped out completely.

 

Well,  yes at the point I'm referring to your literally starting from scratch anyway. Your just starting on the same planet you were already on (vice closing out to main menu and starting a new Planet. 

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Hi everyone,

 

here are my thoughts according the mentioned areas.

 

1. cemetry: works fine for the first few bodies. but is inefficent after some time.

idea of solution: maybe one gravedigger per cemetry is not enough. (same for engineers, fishermen and most of other buildings)

 

2. pyre: works fine sometimes, but have no clue how to influence if it does not work.

idea of solution: some kind of "priest" who is collecting the needed wood and bringing the bodies to the pyre.

 

3. breeding: definitly the main problem, that has impact on nearly everything in the game. I love the idea of the population growing on their own, but the balancing will be impossible.

idea of solution: some essential controls about building stone huts and breeding. some kind of pause-button for building/breeding. could be limited to god power or time.

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